Does anybody have a Viceroy Mk1 TDS1/1/GBL Metric (3mm lead screw) Lathe fitted with a thread indicator dial? if so please could you tell me how many and what sizes the gears are on the indicator dial (the one that meshes with the leadscrew itself). I've tried to work it out based on the Spindle:leadscrew gear ratios for the given thread pitches, but have arrived at numerous different options and a very large Excel Spreadsheet! Is it likely they are the same as the Mk2 which uses 28 & 30 tooth gears? as per the drawings posted previously?
Any help would save me a lot of headache's
Thanks!
TDS 1/1/GBL Mk1 Thread Indicator Dial
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Drofnedone
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Re: TDS 1/1/GBL Mk1 Thread Indicator Dial
Hi ASJ
Yes I have the lathe in question.
I will make an effort to investigate in the daylight tomorrow.
Mine is the metric version.
Incidentally there is only ONE mark on the indicator dial, and when cutting metric gears, you have to wait for it to come around every time before you can engage the split nut.
And when cutting Imperial, you cannot dissengage the leadscrew at all, and you have to drive the saddle back and forth WITH THE MOTOR REVERSE SWITCH, and with the tool backed off when in the reverse direction.
I have all the parts needed for imperial screwcutting, and some drawings of setup if you need some info.
You are very lucky, as I only joined the Denford forum TODAY. Thur 4 Feb
I noticed that there has been lots of activity relative to this machine, and yet in the past, no-one wanted them when they came up on Ebay. I have had mine for about 25 Years. I read a previous post concerning the different gear pitches namely 16 and 18 DP.
As you probably know, the original end gears enabling a wide range of threads are 16DP, and when you do the conversion to Imperial, all the end gears change to 18DP.(Except the one on the mandrel and the reverse cluster.)
I am of the opinion that it is because for the conversion, you have to use a huge wheel with two tooth counts, 127 and 135. If these were in 16DP, the wheel would be too big to allow the end cover to close, so they made that wheel and all the others into 18DP.
Rgds cruikshankdavid at aol dot com
Yes I have the lathe in question.
I will make an effort to investigate in the daylight tomorrow.
Mine is the metric version.
Incidentally there is only ONE mark on the indicator dial, and when cutting metric gears, you have to wait for it to come around every time before you can engage the split nut.
And when cutting Imperial, you cannot dissengage the leadscrew at all, and you have to drive the saddle back and forth WITH THE MOTOR REVERSE SWITCH, and with the tool backed off when in the reverse direction.
I have all the parts needed for imperial screwcutting, and some drawings of setup if you need some info.
You are very lucky, as I only joined the Denford forum TODAY. Thur 4 Feb
I noticed that there has been lots of activity relative to this machine, and yet in the past, no-one wanted them when they came up on Ebay. I have had mine for about 25 Years. I read a previous post concerning the different gear pitches namely 16 and 18 DP.
As you probably know, the original end gears enabling a wide range of threads are 16DP, and when you do the conversion to Imperial, all the end gears change to 18DP.(Except the one on the mandrel and the reverse cluster.)
I am of the opinion that it is because for the conversion, you have to use a huge wheel with two tooth counts, 127 and 135. If these were in 16DP, the wheel would be too big to allow the end cover to close, so they made that wheel and all the others into 18DP.
Rgds cruikshankdavid at aol dot com
David C
Re: TDS 1/1/GBL Mk1 Thread Indicator Dial
Hi David, Welcome to the forum.
Thanks for your reply, I would really appreciate it if you could have a look. There has been a previous thread on the same subject (called "Dial Thread Indicator - Viceroy Mk 2" in Denford Classifieds) where someone kindly posted all the drawings for the thread indicator dial for the Mk2 lathe but i was not sure if these were the same as the Mk1. In your experience, do you have to wait a long time for the dial to come back around to the "12 o'clock" position when cutting metric threads? my calculations show that the leadscrew / dial must be revolving pretty slowly at the finer thread pitches.
I have had my lathe quite a while, and in good old engineering tradition my grandad had it before me, but i am only just starting to experiment with screw cutting so any info is greatly appreciated. having been educated in the Metric era I'm going to hone my skills at that before attempting any imperial screw cutting.
I am also new to the forum but have found that "Dazz" has written some excellent threads on this lathe. I suppose you will know most of it if you've had your lathe 25 years, but worth a look anyway.
Thanks Again, Alex.
Thanks for your reply, I would really appreciate it if you could have a look. There has been a previous thread on the same subject (called "Dial Thread Indicator - Viceroy Mk 2" in Denford Classifieds) where someone kindly posted all the drawings for the thread indicator dial for the Mk2 lathe but i was not sure if these were the same as the Mk1. In your experience, do you have to wait a long time for the dial to come back around to the "12 o'clock" position when cutting metric threads? my calculations show that the leadscrew / dial must be revolving pretty slowly at the finer thread pitches.
I have had my lathe quite a while, and in good old engineering tradition my grandad had it before me, but i am only just starting to experiment with screw cutting so any info is greatly appreciated. having been educated in the Metric era I'm going to hone my skills at that before attempting any imperial screw cutting.
I am also new to the forum but have found that "Dazz" has written some excellent threads on this lathe. I suppose you will know most of it if you've had your lathe 25 years, but worth a look anyway.
Thanks Again, Alex.
Alex
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Drofnedone
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Re: TDS 1/1/GBL Mk1 Thread Indicator Dial
Hi Alex
I have inspected my lathe thread dial. It came off easily for a close inspection.
Mine has 30 teeth and is 30mm in diameter.
It has a list of thread counts and only one engage marking.
Perhaps there was another unit complete for other threads with perhaps more engage indications, but in my list of part numbers (and prices) there is only one threading dial device shown. It was £8.00
Are you saying that you do not have a threading dial on your lathe?
Don't know how to post pictures here so if you need any, contact me on the Email that I left in my first post and I will send them to you.
I was amused by an old post concerning the nose thread.
As far as I am concerned, it is 1 and 1/2" BSF.
I have made an adapter using a standard full nut ordered from an enginers supplier, and an absolute perfect fit. All I had to do was screw it on my lathe against a thick washer to press against the spindle register and turn a register on the exposed end. Then when removed and turned around it was a perfect fit including the registers. I was making an adapter to take 20mm collets. Now I wouldn't be without them.
Do you have collets?
Rgds David C
I have inspected my lathe thread dial. It came off easily for a close inspection.
Mine has 30 teeth and is 30mm in diameter.
It has a list of thread counts and only one engage marking.
Perhaps there was another unit complete for other threads with perhaps more engage indications, but in my list of part numbers (and prices) there is only one threading dial device shown. It was £8.00
Are you saying that you do not have a threading dial on your lathe?
Don't know how to post pictures here so if you need any, contact me on the Email that I left in my first post and I will send them to you.
I was amused by an old post concerning the nose thread.
As far as I am concerned, it is 1 and 1/2" BSF.
I have made an adapter using a standard full nut ordered from an enginers supplier, and an absolute perfect fit. All I had to do was screw it on my lathe against a thick washer to press against the spindle register and turn a register on the exposed end. Then when removed and turned around it was a perfect fit including the registers. I was making an adapter to take 20mm collets. Now I wouldn't be without them.
Do you have collets?
Rgds David C
David C
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Drofnedone
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Re: TDS 1/1/GBL Mk1 Thread Indicator Dial
Alex
I meant to add that I noted that you live only a stones throw away from Brighouse home of Denford. Many years ago I visited The site to buy a few gears that were missing and was lucky enough to meet a Mr Ian Vickery who new the lathe in detail. He gave me a lot of info including some copies of the headstock and gearbox drawings.Whilst in the store one of the storemen asked if I knew what some great big wheels were for. There was a stack of them about 3 feet high. There was thick dust on the top one. He said that whatever they were, he had never been asked for one. They were of course the 135/127 metric to imperial conversion wheels. There was also a whole box full of rusty quadrant castings .
Not long afterwards I went back to purchase another part only to find that Our lathe had become obsolete and all the parts had been cleared out of the store. Probably skipped.
I imagine that if they were skipped, then if that skip were around tooday, it would be worth a lot of money. Do you have the conversion Items?
Rgds David C
I meant to add that I noted that you live only a stones throw away from Brighouse home of Denford. Many years ago I visited The site to buy a few gears that were missing and was lucky enough to meet a Mr Ian Vickery who new the lathe in detail. He gave me a lot of info including some copies of the headstock and gearbox drawings.Whilst in the store one of the storemen asked if I knew what some great big wheels were for. There was a stack of them about 3 feet high. There was thick dust on the top one. He said that whatever they were, he had never been asked for one. They were of course the 135/127 metric to imperial conversion wheels. There was also a whole box full of rusty quadrant castings .
Not long afterwards I went back to purchase another part only to find that Our lathe had become obsolete and all the parts had been cleared out of the store. Probably skipped.
I imagine that if they were skipped, then if that skip were around tooday, it would be worth a lot of money. Do you have the conversion Items?
Rgds David C
David C
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Drofnedone
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Re: TDS 1/1/GBL Mk1 Thread Indicator Dial
Hi Alex
It's me yet again
I have learnt something today.
Looking at the other post about this subject. I saw a box with metal printed plates that gave another list of threads that do not appear on my plate. namely :- 4.0,3.5,1.75,0,8,0.7,and 0.35
Looking closer on the newly found plate you can see '28 Teeth' printed.
The indicator on my plate says '30 Teeth'
So it seems that to cut the whole range of Metric threads you need to have one or the other of the two wheels fitted to the threading dial.
And as I said in my first post, with the imperial conversion gears fitted, the threading indicator cannot be used at all.
Rgds David C
It's me yet again
I have learnt something today.
Looking at the other post about this subject. I saw a box with metal printed plates that gave another list of threads that do not appear on my plate. namely :- 4.0,3.5,1.75,0,8,0.7,and 0.35
Looking closer on the newly found plate you can see '28 Teeth' printed.
The indicator on my plate says '30 Teeth'
So it seems that to cut the whole range of Metric threads you need to have one or the other of the two wheels fitted to the threading dial.
And as I said in my first post, with the imperial conversion gears fitted, the threading indicator cannot be used at all.
Rgds David C
David C
Re: TDS 1/1/GBL Mk1 Thread Indicator Dial
Hi David,
Thankyou for looking at the dial gear, it seems from your description that the dial indicator is pretty much the same as the Mk 2 one shown in the previous subjects. I dont have the dial indicator on my lathe so I was planning on making one. I just need to source or make the correct size gears. I cant find the exact ones quoted on the drawings for the Mk2 version but I think the metric equivalent might be close enough. It seems that although the lathe is metric, ironically all its components are imperial! From what I've read you must need the 28 tooth gear aswell to do the full range of threads. Incidentally those plates you mentioned in the photo seem to be up for grabs, admin said i could have some if i called in. It makes you wonder what they might have lying around that no one knows about. maybe they've got some thread dial castings kicking around somwhere!
Its interesting you mention the collets, i have a set or ER25 collets for my milling machine, and was thinking once i have practised my screwcutting a bit I would like to make a chuck so i can yse them on my lathe. I will send you an email so you can reply with the pictures you have taken, They would be a great help with my project.
Thanks
Alex.
Thankyou for looking at the dial gear, it seems from your description that the dial indicator is pretty much the same as the Mk 2 one shown in the previous subjects. I dont have the dial indicator on my lathe so I was planning on making one. I just need to source or make the correct size gears. I cant find the exact ones quoted on the drawings for the Mk2 version but I think the metric equivalent might be close enough. It seems that although the lathe is metric, ironically all its components are imperial! From what I've read you must need the 28 tooth gear aswell to do the full range of threads. Incidentally those plates you mentioned in the photo seem to be up for grabs, admin said i could have some if i called in. It makes you wonder what they might have lying around that no one knows about. maybe they've got some thread dial castings kicking around somwhere!
Its interesting you mention the collets, i have a set or ER25 collets for my milling machine, and was thinking once i have practised my screwcutting a bit I would like to make a chuck so i can yse them on my lathe. I will send you an email so you can reply with the pictures you have taken, They would be a great help with my project.
Thanks
Alex.
Alex
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Drofnedone
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Re: TDS 1/1/GBL Mk1 Thread Indicator Dial
Hi Alex
The leadscrew is Metric so the gear will be metric. Module 1 is what you need.
This equates almost perfectly to 27DP.
Rgds David C
The leadscrew is Metric so the gear will be metric. Module 1 is what you need.
This equates almost perfectly to 27DP.
Rgds David C
David C
Re: TDS 1/1/GBL Mk1 Thread Indicator Dial
Thankyou, thats what I needed to confirm, i've been struggling to find "DP" gears of exactly the correct size, but had noticed that Module 1 seems very close, and widely available.
Regards,
Alex
Regards,
Alex
Alex
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Re: TDS 1/1/GBL Mk1 Thread Indicator Dial
Unfortunately, probably not - any old iron was scrapped a few years ago - the only bits still lying around are drawings, books, machine stickers and screen printed plates.maybe they've got some thread dial castings kicking around somwhere!
AndyB has already been for a good look around though, if you want to ask him if he found anything useful.
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Andy B
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Re: TDS 1/1/GBL Mk1 Thread Indicator Dial
As Admin says, I have had a good look around various parts of Denford's premises where there might be any parts for Denford / Viceroy / Senior manual machines, but didn't find any steel / iron parts at all.
Only a few plates, labels and the little plastic covers that were used over the top of cap-head screws to keep the swarf out.
My hopes of finding a stash of gears, steadies, and other useful accessories were dashed!!!
Thankfully, the parts lists and drawings are largely intact - though I'm still hoping that they can be given a good sort through and tidy up at some point.
Andy
Only a few plates, labels and the little plastic covers that were used over the top of cap-head screws to keep the swarf out.
My hopes of finding a stash of gears, steadies, and other useful accessories were dashed!!!
Thankfully, the parts lists and drawings are largely intact - though I'm still hoping that they can be given a good sort through and tidy up at some point.
Andy