Tool change error

sweep · Post by **sweep** » Fri 02 Mar , 2007 0:00 am

I have just powered up my 1991 Triac ATC. The welcome screen prompts me to establish absolute datum by pressing, I think, the ABS button, but after that a fault code comes up "Tool change error."
The toolchanger doesn't rotate to establish a datum location and neither does any axis move, which I suppose can be expected.
Any ideas on how i should figure out the problem?
Looking at the back of the machine, the left hand panel box has two plugs on the underside; one is a 7 pin and is called toolchanger, and the othe says RS232 and is a 5 pin. I also have two short leads taped together, one with a 5 pin and the other with a multipin socket. These fit neatly between the sockets on the panel box and sockets on the main control panel on the base of the machine, but is this where they go and is this why i'm getting the toolchange error.
Obviously I dont want to plug them in just because they fit as I could end up doing a lot of damage if they're for something completely different.

Any advise appreciated.

Thanks ...Richard

Post by **Denford Admin** » Fri 02 Mar , 2007 17:13 pm

Just to make it easier to see what your machine is, a link to your other thread:

viewtopic.php?p=1736

Definately don't connect anything just because it fits, until you're sure what they are !
Have you downloaded all the scraps of drawings and manuals from here ?

A photo of the inside of the electrical box would also help us be sure what we are looking at.

sweep · Post by **sweep** » Fri 02 Mar , 2007 17:42 pm

ok, here a few pics of the inside of the rear cabinets. The left-hand one(viewed from the rear) is full of electrnics whilst the right-hand one is mainly pneumatics.
The left hand one does look to have had a bit of a refit at sometime with evidence of old cabinet holes being covered up and redrilled. The factory records indicate it did come back to Brighouse during 1991 for a refit (?) so this might explain that one.
I will also take a pic of the short lead if anyone needs to look at that, but being only around 12" long it is too short to feed the monitor.
You will also see from the pics the two sockets on the underside of the left hand box.

Thanks ...Richard

p.s. Is Mr Purcell enjoying his retirement?

sweep · Post by **sweep** » Fri 02 Mar , 2007 17:47 pm

...please also note the multi-pin socket on the machines rear panel, not cabinet, just below the word Denford and above the Ext video sockets, that doesn't have a legend??? Very strange

Mr Magoo · Post by **Mr Magoo** » Sat 03 Mar , 2007 14:50 pm

Ahhh - the pics bring back memories !!!

And if my memory serves me right then...

The RS232 connector on the top box should connect to the unmarked socket above the vidoe connector on the back of the machine
The Toolchanger connector on the top box should connect to the 15 pin Aux I/O connector on the back of the machine

Hope this helps

sweep · Post by **sweep** » Sat 03 Mar , 2007 15:01 pm

...well you will either be right or I will have a toasted machine

What you suggest is the only place the short cable can go to, but I needed to get some advice first. I'll bob down stairs now and give it a go.

Thanks ...Richard

sweep · Post by **sweep** » Sat 03 Mar , 2007 18:54 pm

Nothing caught fire so I suppose that's a good thing!
Same fault code showing = Toolchange error
At this point I will ask a very silly question; is there a electro-pneumatic switch that inhibits the machine if there is no air supply? See I was trying to see if the toolchanger worked before buying a compressor, so i suppose that this could be the problem as the there will be a "toolchange error" if there is no air to change the tools ...

What I am trying to achieve is to see if I can get drive on all axis so if anyone knows how to bypass this switch this might sort out my problem. It wont, however, pay for the compressor which i'll have to save up for!

...Richard

Triac whizz · Post by **Triac whizz** » Sat 03 Mar , 2007 21:37 pm

Yup, my Fanuc with ATC won't ref unless air is supplied and the toolchanger is up in postion

Mr Magoo · Post by **Mr Magoo** » Sun 04 Mar , 2007 23:29 pm

I don't think the Triac PNC3 controlled machines had an air pressure swich fitted, but Triac Whizz could be right about the ATC having to be in it's "safe" position (arm up and back). Worth trying to strap it up rather than buy a compressor

sweep · Post by **sweep** » Mon 05 Mar , 2007 20:16 pm

Already tried taping the tool changer arm in the uppermost position but still didn't run. Anyway, I am borrowing a smallish compressor tonight so should find out one way or the other.

...Richard

sweep · Post by **sweep** » Fri 09 Mar , 2007 8:48 am

Borrowed a compressor and got it plumbed in last night. Upon applying air the toolchanger magazine moved back and up into its park position as would be expected, but when I applied power the same fault code came up on screen.
Can anyone supply a trouble-shooting guide or flow chart to help me out as I am now at a loss as my 'expertise' is purely mechanical.
I have noticed some small rectangular objects wired into the system and fixed with double-sided sticky pads to the tops of the solenoid valves. Some of these pads have come away over time and the 'things' are no longer attached. What are they and will refixing them make a difference?

Thannks ...Richard

p.s. any experts want to come round and have a look to help me sort the problem are always welcome. The machine is at my house in Birkenshaw, Bradford, which is around 2 miles from Brighouse

Post by **Denford Admin** » Fri 09 Mar , 2007 9:50 am

I think the black things are suppressors to soak up noise when the solenoid valves are switched (are there two wires off them - going into the solenoid plug top ?).
They would work without them connected anyway so thats not the problem.

Even though the air is on - pressure may not be high enough - can you find an air pressure switch, and see if its switching or try linking it out ?

Post by **Denford Admin** » Fri 09 Mar , 2007 11:32 am

PS - John Purcell has just come in to see us - looking tanned and relaxed

He says retirement is brilliant !

Triac whizz · Post by **Triac whizz** » Fri 09 Mar , 2007 13:00 pm

Try looking for micro switches - check wires & that they are making contact.. I guess the setup on the ATC is the same as a Fanuc one

sweep · Post by **sweep** » Sat 10 Mar , 2007 14:22 pm

The good news - Found the problem and cleared the fault code. There is a 'kettle' lead from the base of the machine which brings power into the left hand box at the rear of the machine which, I guess, controls the toolchanger. I unplugged this cable and checked for supply ith my 40 year old AVO meter and there was no power. After borrowing the kettles lead from the kitchen, shh!, I fed a seperate supply and it burst into life.

The bad news - Still wont run. After I am prompted to press ABS datum on the welcome screen it then says 'start drives' but when I press the 'start drive' button nothing happens. If I press any other button on the machine console you can hear a 'click' from inside the machine registering the keystroke even though nothing can happen. This does not happen with the 'start drives' button.

thanks ...Richard

p.s. should this be a new thread now?

Mr Magoo · Post by **Mr Magoo** » Sun 11 Mar , 2007 22:29 pm

Sounds like the supply is missing to the Drives circuit (the supply to the Toolchanger Box probably comes from the same source).

Check the fuses on the main PCB inside the Triac (see here viewtopic.php?t=300 for details on how to get at the triac electrics) and any other fuses you find inside.

Also check the E-STOP button is released and is operating OK.

sweep · Post by **sweep** » Mon 12 Mar , 2007 11:45 am

Cheers Mr Magoo. You are right in that the Drives seem to be taken from the same main contactor. I'll start a new thread as I think the Toolchanger problem was the consequence of this issue.

Thanks ...Richard

Denford Software & Machines

Denford Software & Machines

Tool change error

Tool change error