Power cross feed won't work on my TDS 1/1.

[Dougiealan]

Hello I reciently bought a viceroy tds 1/1 but haven't taken delivery yet (so no serial number yet). The company I purchased it from informed me that it he reason it hasn't been dispatched was due to the power cross feed being faulty and they are trying to get it going for me. I'd just like to know can parts be sourced to getter power cross feed going and has anyone got photos or drawings that could help me, is this a common fault on the TDS 1/1?

[LesT]

I wouldn't worry about the cross feed, it might take you ages to source parts to get it fixed.
It's not essential for the Lathe operation. I rarely use mine.
I would be more concerned about the company going bust, if you have paid for it !
You would become an unsecured creditor, you might get nothing.
Tell them to forget the cross feed and Just get the Lathe!.
Cheers,
Les.T.

[Dougiealan]

Thanks for the reply, I hope that doesn't happen I will phone them in the morning and get it sent up, they seem to be a pretty big outfit with a good reputation.
It sounds as if there's something adrift or worn possibly so hopefully I can repair it easily as I'd like to have everything working as it's supposed to even if I rarely use it.

[Andy B]

I agree with Les that the power X-feed is not essential - but very nice to have if you do have any large diameter jobs to face off.

Spares are only available from machines being broken for spares - but any drawings for parts should be on this forum.

Something not working in the apron could be a sign that it needs a strip, clean and re-fit - See the thread by 'Dazz' here - viewtopic.php?f=14&t=449.
Then, at least, you'll know its good to go for another 25 years or more, with any further wear minimised.

Andy

[Dougiealan]

That's great thanks for the link to the photos it doesn't look like there's much in the apron. I believe the machine was from a school so I hope it's just dirt or something minor and it ain't been abused by bairns! like you both say I can use it as it is for now and keep an eye out for spares if needed I will post photos once I pull it apart.
I'm going to phone and organise delivery for ASAP.

Cheers Al .

[dazz]

Hi

Congratulations on your new old lathe purchase.

Don't be nervous about diving into the apron. It is quite simple.
I removed the apron by taking of the lead/feed screw support on the tailstock end of the lathe. I then slide the carriage/apron out past the tailstock end of the bed.
Make sure the lead/feed screw are supported to avoid bending them.

[Dougiealan]

Hi, Thanks for the info Daz the photos on you're page have given me a rough idea of what's behind there the machine will be here today or tomorrow it will be outing in the shed until I get back from sea, I will post photos I just hope all the mechanics are still inside.

[Dougiealan]

The machine finally turned up today I'm at sea so still ain't seen it!, it seems it ain't a metric as I thought that doesn't bother me though. The wife sent me the serial number I wouldn't mind knowing a bit more about the machine can any one help me regarding this?
viceroy tds 1 1689 1. And is there a manual available I can't see a PDF on the site.

Regards Alan.

[dazz]

Hi

The big advantage with an imperial lathe is that you can make tools, chuck back plates and adapters that fit the spindle.
The only time I have absolutely needed a metric thread was when I made an ER32 collet chuck. I had to get someone else to machine that.

I don't think anyone has been able to get any useful information from serial numbers.

The manual is on this site somewhere. If you can't find it, PM me with your email address and I will send you a copy.

[Dougiealan]

Hi Daz, aye I agree with you regarding that one, I'm thinking if I get a 127 tooth gear i could cut metric using the 8TPI leadscrew formula P=drivers/driven x 127/20?. I found and printed off a manual from the site but it doesn't seem to relate to my model the levers are all in different lications than they are in the drawings & of photos of other viceroy machines. I will post photos when I'm home so you can see what I'm on about May be its a older model?

Regards Alan.

[dazz]

Hi
I went down the same road after I brought my lathe. To do metric, you need a whole set of change gears plus a custom made banjo (cast and machined).
After all that time and money, you only end up with a subset of metric threads. Somewhere on this site, I uploaded a spreadsheet calculator for imperial to metric conversion.

It would be cheaper to convert the lathe to CNC. The problem with that approach is that all the extra features you paid for like the gear box become redundant. The Viceroy really isn't big enough to fit ballscrews and other CNC stuff.

I looked at the ELS http://autoartisans.com/ELS/ project but there are serious deficiencies related to the 1 pulse/revolution spindle sensing. It means that threads are distorted when the cutting load changes.

I decided that my Viceroy lathe was too good to convert to CNC. A conversion would devalue it. I have been making mechanical tooling and accessories to build up its capability.

My solution to this whole problem has been to buy a 2nd lathe. I now have a Nardini MS350 which does metric and imperial.

I have found that an imperial-only Viceroy is not a serious deficiency. If you really must do metric threading, you have the wrong lathe.

[Dougiealan]

Na I wouldn't want to go down that route or the route of cnc I would like to cut metric but not if it's going to be a big expense. The lathe will do me fine as it is then I don't do a lot of screw cutting anyway except wee jobs e.g sounding caps on boats or making a face plate or something all my other lathe work is on motorbikes.
I had a chester model b lathe that cut both metric and imperial threads but it was rubbish quality so I sent it back and decided to get a old well built machine and got the viceroy I think she should suit my needs.
I will be fitting the single phase motor when I get home to get her going until I get a inverter and hopefully get the power cross feed going too.
Is there any photos of the tools you have made on here Daz?

Regards Alan.

[dazz]

Hi

I have gone the same path. Old but good.

You can see samples of my work on the projects forum here viewforum.php?f=14
The Viceroy is a very capable machine.

[Dougiealan]

Aye nice work mate are you a machinist to trade? I hope I can achieve a nice finishes like that when I get mine running.
I got the wife to send me a photo to show you what I mean about the location of the leavers.
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If anyone can give me any info as to what's what I'd appreciate it like I said I haven't seen the machine yet but it doesn't seem to look anything like the lay out of the machine in the manual or anything like any one on here's machine.
It looks like the kids at the school scraped the majority of the paint off it but I'm going to paint it anyway.

[dazz]

Hi

I had some training when I was young but I am just a home work shop hack.
First results weren't that good but with better steel and technique, things improved.

I haven't seen your model but it looks like the top lever is for the back gear and the lower lever is spindle gear speed change.
There is no threading gearbox so I'd expect to see a pile of loose gears with the lathe to setup for threading.

[Dougiealan]

That's the same as myself I started off in welding & fabrication then got a engineering apprenticeship but hardly touched a lathe just big diesels. Got in to our home port today so I got the wife to pick me up to have a look at the lathe got the 3 phase motor out then hauled the apron off for a look.
I found there was a shaft missing but all the gears were wedged in place with a pice of hss, out of the way of the gears that are still in operation so I should get it going.
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[Dougiealan]

What do you think of this chart seems I can cut metric and imperial? I did get a bundle of change gears with the machine.
The top lever seems to be a spindle lock.
The 1 underneath has 3 positions, speeds may be?
And the other one to the left is tumbler gears like on a myford, will this reverse the leadscrew & chuck? Might just have to wait & see but if anyone has any info on this model of
TDS I'd love to know about it.

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[dazz]

If your leadscrew is imperial and you have a 127 tooth gear, you can cut metric threads.
The range of metric threads you can cut will depend on the range of gears you have.

[joncritoph]

blimey they are some big pictures !

from what i can see and by going off my metric machine, the left hand lever is indeed the tumbler and will reverse the rotation of both feed shaft and lead screw
the top lever engages back gear, anti clock should be top speeds, and clock wise should drop speeds by half
lower lever - probably selects between driving the feed screw or feed shaft
speeds should be selected by moving the belt onto a different pulley

there are a few little things that could be stopping the x feed working but its most likely simple there is a shear pin located in the headstock, but that would stop both feed shaft and lead screw

hope that helps a bit

[Dougiealan]

That's what I though, so I don't have to get anything made up I assume I can do the math and chuck in the appropriate gears?
God knows how they are so big lol, I used the method I use to get the bb code on costomfighters site. Aye that helped thanks
you were right regarding lever functions I just had to align the gears up so that they functioned accordingly when the lever
position is changed. It was pretty straight forward just a case of getting the shafts at the right spot for a smooth I also got
the power feeds going & the single phase conversion (I think single phase is fine decent finish to materials & a good range of speeds)
is done I just need to change the belts finish a bit of welding to the cabinet, then clean it up ready for paint.
I will post another massive picture once I get it done.